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Sudanese dictator Omar al-Bashir. (source)
Slovenia’s president Janez DrnovÅ¡ek has recently been travelling around the world trying to rattle up support for his Darfur initiative. So far it’s drawn some lukewarm support from France, the United States and elsewhere. DrnovÅ¡ek is expected to travel to Sudan personally later this month for further talks. In a recent interview with CNN, they mention that part of his plan would involve housing 10,000 Sudanese refugees in Slovenia. Logistics and feasability aside, that’s the kind of selfless benevolence you just don’t hear from politicians these days, especially European ones. That’s why I think that DrnovÅ¡ek’s efforts, even if they don’t go anywhere politically, may still bear a lot of fruit at home. This initiative is bringing up a lot of interesting questions about what Slovenia’s role in the world is, and what it should be. The fact that DrnovÅ¡ek has decided to intensely involve himself with this, when he could just as easily sit back and enjoy the delicious side benefits of the largely ceremonial presidency, is in itself quite inspirational and does this nation proud. I know I am.
In the meantime, though, Slovenia’s private industry has also been involved in some Sudanese initiatives of their own: supplying the Sudanese dictator Field Marshal Omar al-Bashir (currently number one on the Parade list of the world’s worst dictators) with a $4.5 million luxury yacht. The New York Times recently published a story about the boat’s difficult trip from Slovenia’s Adriatic coast to Sudan. You can read it here: Sudan Leader Waits, and Waits, for His Ship to Come In. (Printer-friendly version)
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But really, is the solution for Darfur to transfer it´s inhabitants to other places? While this sounds overwhelmingly benevolent I think a better solution would be something similar of what the kurds in Irak had for many years before Saddam (and his weapons of massde….oh sorry;o)) was toppled. A protected zone so that the inhabitants could feel safe.
Not to mention the shock from climate change these poor people would suffer.
A capitalist Slovenia where good business is good business, nevermind the minor details. Right?
apparently there’d been a miscommunication there, though. drnovsek’s original idea was to build a refugee camp, but in sudan, not in slovenia. cnn seems to slip on their foreign research a lot lately…
I think the reporter and Drnovšek misunderstood each other. Anyway Drnovšek
speaks about reaction of people to the proposal, and not about reaction
to moving 10.000 people from Sudan to Slovenia, so I think he didn’t
proposed that.
I am most proud of him attending the inauguration ceremonies of
new Bolivian president, Evo Morales. Imagine: first Indian president of
a South American state. After how many years? 500? 1000? (and there is
only 15% white population in Bolivia). Traditional ceremonies
performed at an ancient Indian temple. A landmark I would say.
Hopefully also an empowering event and a turning point for them. I wish them all the luck.
I’m so disappointed. It also struck me as strange, but I figured DrnovÅ¡ek’s official site would include a disclaimer if it wasn’t accurate.I have to admit, though: a colony of 10,000 Sudanese in Slovenia would definitely make the country a more interesting place.
the last indian president of a latin-american country was benito juarez,
130 years ago. that aside, i share some of niks enthusiasm. it just
feels good to see the once ever gloomy drnovsek boasting such enchanting, feel good smiles.one
more thing we got out of drnovsek’s latin america adventure is the
photo of drnovsek in bright indian garments, playing the flute, looking
all new age like. (couldn’t find it on the net, i’ll post a link if i
do - it’s well worth seeing) that one deserves to go on t-shirts along
che and the likes…
Given his health issues, one can’t help but wonder if all this isn’t just his last hurrah - something he thinks would make him immortal in the eyes of the whole world, rather than just Slovenians. The Nobel Peace Prize is practically his if he achieves results in Darfur. Go Janez, go!!!
I second what freddie said. While I’m positively shocked at what the Beloved Leader (one of Drnovsek’s nicknames) does, I can’t help but wonder wether he’s about to take the train to the Big Adios. If not, there’s another question: what’s he on ?!?!? He’s been all smiles lately, he just needs a "peace" sign around his neck and a couple of Lennon-style sunglasses. Cannabis maybe? It’s often used as a relief drug in cancer patients.But other than that I just love what he does. And apparently he knows what’s he doing. And I simply enjoy the puzzled looks on faces of Slovene politicians, so used to "directed" democracy.
I think Nik’s right (God, I hope so!): DrnovÅ¡ek meant the "Slovenian" camp would be put up in Darfur, nothing about hosting in Slovenia.And BTW: Morales isn’t the first native-american president in Latin America. Nor the first in Bolivia, for that matter. Benito Juárez (legendary president of Mexico), Andrés de Santa Cruz Calahuma (president of both Bolivia and Peru in the 1830’s), Jaime Paz Zamorra (1898-1993), Lidia Gueiler Tejada (president de Bolivia 1979 and 1980: also the first woman president much before Michelle Bachelet). The media blew the whole good-guy-native-president-Morales out of proportion. There’s a great article about it in the last "Mladina" (or the one before) by Jorge Castañeda. If you’re intereseted in this stuff, I reccomend reading it.
Jaime Paz Zamorra was of course no Mathusalem. The correct zears are 1988-1993 (in Bolivia).
The Slovenia Times has a photo of DrnovÅ¡ek "the new-age radical" here. (Don’t know if it’s photoshopped or not)
I have to admit, though: a colony of 10,000 Sudanese in Slovenia would definitely make the country a more interesting place. In a country as xenophobic as Slovenia, these poor Sudanese and Drnovšek would most probably get kicked out in no time.
"In a country as xenophobic as Slovenia, these poor Sudanese and Drnovšek would most probably get kicked out in no time"Want a redneck anwser: try hosting them in your own backyard.
Ah, the classic SEP attitude: Somebody Else’s problem. The debate on wether the Darfur refugees were to come to Slovenia is purely hypothetical, since Drnie said they weren’t. But if we as a nation trully stand firm behind our Prez, then we shouldn’t mind 10.000 refugees here. Admiteddly it would be no piece of cake, but still
Taking 10,000 Sudanese refugees to Slovenia is pure madness..I’m not saying that cause I’m "xenophobic" (I’m not!), it’s just thatt this is such a logistic feat that in the end won’t make much sense. Why not build one in a neighbouring country or just in a safe part of Sudan. Why house 10,000 refugees in some godforsaken country in the middle of a geographical black hole that’s thousands of miles away from Darfur? It seems weird.Then again, it was only an error in CNN’s reporting, as usual.I have to agree I applaud DrnovÅ¡ek for his recent actions, although the last one about giving clemency to Danilo KovaÄ?iÄ? puzzles me a bit..
Sorry about the horrible grammar in my last reply, multitasking does that to ya..
"Ah, the classic SEP attitude"I hope you didn’t mean me by this. I’m actually thrilled by Drni’s proposal. I’ve been following news from Sudan for quite some time and was being furious about the ignorance showed by the West (expecially Europe!). I’d put the whole Sudan islamist-racist elite in prision. But nooo, we have to monitor the situationand all that shit. God, do I hate EU’s submissiveness towards islamist regimes!
But think of what 10,000 people - Slovene or not - would do to boost the population! Of course, that’s assuming they do not get sent to Slovakia by mistake. ;-)In all seriousness, I am now living in Minneapolis (“White Bread Central” of the upper mid-western U.S.), where they have welcomed thousands of Hmong (we have the largest concentration in the U.S.) and Somali (over 50% of my ESL students are from Somalia) over the past decade. While some native Minnesotans will certainly disagree to what extent this is true, I have seen them assimilate very well into our population. They have even adjusted to the extreme winters (typical January ranges from 12 to 23 degrees Celsius). And what a shot in the arm they’ve given to the food out here! If the 10,000 immigrants were resettled in Slovenia, it would not be the worst thing that could happen to them or to Slovenia, as long as they are not ostracized for being “burdensome”. Sometimes this is a lot to ask. But don’t you think there is also a price to be paid for a population being too homogenous?
Cornelius: the last indian president of a latin-american country was benito juarez,
130 years ago.
Luka: And BTW: Morales isn’t the first native-american president…
From Delo: "V Boliviji so potekale predÄ?asne predsedniÅ¡ke volitve… Evo Morales, ki bi v primeru zmage postal prvi Indijanec na Ä?elu države."
Another from Delo: "Morales, indijanec iz rodu Aymara, je tako oÄ?itno postal prvi predstavnik staroselcev na Ä?elu države …
From Mladina: "Prisegel prvi indijanski predsednik Bolivije"
So it was meant for Bolivia only, not
whole South America as I thought. (Juarez doesn’t count, he is not
South America; although I admit I
didn’t really know what ethnicity he was - I presumed Spanish.) But it
seems it is wrong as well. Bad reporting of our media? (Probably not
just ours.) Anyway still I like the traditional ceremonies part.
(how do I put links so that they are clickable? I have tried everything I know, but no success.)
Cornelius: one
more thing we got out of drnovsek’s latin america adventure is the
photo of drnovsek in bright indian garments, playing the flute, looking
all new age like.
I have seen it yes. I think it is from new Mladina (not 100%, haven’t read it yet). Although
I don’t see anything newagey there, he is more like those Indian
pan-flute band members that played in Slovenia some years ago (How was
the name of the band? Machu-Pichu?)
Luka: I’d put the whole Sudan islamist-racist elite in prision. But nooo,
we have to monitor the situation and all that shit. God, do I hate EU’s
submissiveness towards islamist regimes!
It took cca 10 years to do anything substantial in Europe (and it wasn’t EU who did it). When
it’s Africa’s turn (Islam or not)? Sometime around never… see Rwanda.
nik: well, maybe you’re right. maybe that photo is not so much
newage-y as it is south-american-indian-street-hawker-y. one thing is
certain, it’s anything but presidential, and i don’t mean that in a bad
way. i saw the photo first in mladina, but saw it published elsewhere
as well. i checked and the office of the president is cited as the
source! i couldn’t find it on the presidents office website, but unless
someone else has a link, i know i’ll be able to post a link to it
sometime on saturday or sunday, when the internet version of the
mladina issue in question is posted.as for publishing links:
there should be a small chain icon in the toolbar above the comments
box. highlight a portion of the text, press the chain icon and voila. i
usually use opera, and it doesn’t support this option, so whenever i
post a more complex post, i use firefox.
the above somebody was me.
Hm, Wikipedia says too: "Juan Evo Morales Ayma"… the country’s first Amerindian president. He has become the first indigenous person to lead the nation of Bolivia as its head of state in over 500 years since the Spanish Conquest"
Cornelius: Well, it just reminded me of them. They were
playing flutes, he is playing a flute; they wear ponÄ?os, he is wearing
a ponÄ?o. And he wears it over his suit… I thought about
internet version of Mladina as well, but I’m not sure if they publish
pictures there… and since I have a scanner in my vicinity: Drni at Titikaka.
And thanks for help with links. I’m blind
, I was trying to write HREF tags (in 1000 different ways).
I know: that was point. Everybody says he’s the first native president and he’s not. The same goes for Lidia Gueiler Tejada: she was not a native, as may be understood from my comment, but was the first woman president of South America. And yet the media kept repeting Michel Bachelet of Chile would be the first woman to hold this office in South America.
have to admit, though: a colony of 10,000 Sudanese in Slovenia would definitely make the country a more interesting place.it would make Slovenia a much more dangerous place tooThank god that Drnovsek meant building a camp in Sudan and not in Slovenia.
marco… can you explain why Slovenia would be much more dangerous place? terrorism? disease? because they are muslim? because they are from sudan? or just phobia from immigrants?
@Luka: No, I didn’t mean anybody specifically. It was just an observation. Let’s say it was a lone thought of mine wandering through the internet void… Ah well, It’s 11PM and I’m still at work. Not thinking straight anymore
yes to all of the above, don’t be so politically correct, it seems as though anybody with an opinion is chastized as a racist, xenophobic bigot. I have lived in a multi-cultural country for over 20 years and believe me it was not pretty.
I have to agree with Marco there. Common sense is not racism. If anybody who points out factual problems is labeled as a racist, then people will start to use this designation as kind of a proud self-designation. Which is already happening and I think it’s terrible.So please, let’s use this terms with parsimony. We don’t want to be as old Mr. McCarthy and his widespread "communism", now would we?
@Marco: To continue with this line of thought… Why would Slovenia become a more dangerous place? I can understand your point of view altough I cannot bring myself to sharing it. The issue is not wether Slovenia would adopt 10.000 people from Darfur for good, but wether to accomodate them insofar as the situation in Darfur calms down and becomes bearable. Slovenia is xenophobic, make no mistake about it. And I’m sure that most of the populace were to react extremely negatively if someone (even if it is Drnie) told them that ten thousand black people are comming here to stay. But they wouldn’t. They’d be refugees. Just like when Slovenia accomodatec 250.000 Bosnian refugees from 1992 to 1995. There were tensions, but very few of Bosnians came here to stay
BTW: this whole debate is purely academmical. We all know for a fact that Drnie did not plan on bringing a10.000-strong fan club from Darfur
Why would Slovenia become a more dangerous place?They come from an under-developed continent and the majority of them would never be able to assimilate, not to mention the fact that the rate of sex crimes and/or violent crimes committed by africans is astronomically higher compared to those of europeans. Just like when Slovenia accomodatec 250.000 Bosnian refugees from 1992 to 1995. There were tensions, but very few of Bosnians came here to stayComparing Bosnians to Africans is not an accurate representation of the ‘proposed’ situation. We once were under the same federation as Bosnians and while very different, culturally closer to them then to any African. I can understand your point of view altough I cannot bring myself to sharing itperhaps you can’t now living in lily white slovenia, but you would if you were in a black neighbourhood somewhere in america, and believe me, your love and acceptance for them wouldn’t make much of difference when they would hunt you down.Slovenia is xenophobic, make no mistake about it.I don’t deny that, but why is that such a crime? Why are European’s supposed to open their doors to everyone but everyone else can keep theirs shut. Especially since we are dying out.
I’m sorry Marco, I’m not sure I understand what you meant by ‘they would hunt you down.’? Perhaps
I could gently direct you to read ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ (Harper Lee)
or watch the movie ‘Mississippi Burning’ for a more accurate view of
how black people are treated.If the population growth numbers are right there’ll be nobody left in Slovenia to keep it lily white anyway.All the best.
perhaps I could direct you to the nearest un-brainwashing facility, oh and by the way, don’t be so pessimistic, it doesn’t suit you
I’m sorry Marco, I’m not sure I understand what you meant by ‘they would hunt you down.’?
go to the projects in compton or harlem and then you’ll understand, but hey it’s ok, you’ve read books and watched movies. Or better yet, check out France, especially the no-go zones, but its o.k. tell them you’ve read books and watched movies,and that you have had the part of your brain that thinks rationally and logically removed.
Do you see what I meant with my last comment?
Can we not get nasty and personal, that might make others think
there’s little substance behind what’s being said. I’ll start by saying
apologies if the suggestion of reading a book etc was offensive, or
even threatening : )
Best. X X
I only read the Financial Times, the rest are details. You seem to have everything nicely settled in your fantasy world of fictional books and movies
Speaking of Darfur…don’t know if you read the New York
Times, but Nicholas Kristof had an op-ed on the state of U.S. health
care which included a reference to Slovenia which drew protests from
some Slovenes (and me). Kristof then published this apology:
http://kristof.page.nytimes.com/b/a/240148.htm
Jan. 31, 2006
Apologies to Slovenia
In today’s column, I tried to dramatize the problem’s with America’s
health care system by saying that it was scandalous that an American
baby is less likely to survive its first year than a Slovenian baby.
Alas, Slovenians are offended that I think this is scandalous. They
think it stands to reason that Slovenia should be superior to the U.S.
in this regard.
I want to be nice to Slovenia, because its president is a leader in
pushing for more action on Darfur. And, for the record, Slovenia’s
infant mortality rate is not just a wee bit better than America’s –
it’s about half our rate.
Some people have argued that America has a lousy infant mortality
rate simply because we keep better records than other countries, and
our hospitals are more punctilious about recording an infant who dies
immediately after birth as a death, rather than just a stillbirth.
That’s possible. But our maternal mortality rates are 50 percent higher
than Europe’s, and it’s harder to explain that as a record-keeping
problem. There’s no such thing as still-motherhood. Plus there’s a
directional problem — in the last couple of years our infant mortality
rate has edged up, after 40 years of going down. That’s pretty hard to
explain, except to say that we have a crisis in health care.
Hmmm. Considering that Slovenia arguably has better medical stats
than we do, and its president is active on Darfur and ours isn’t, and
its president actually has better command of English than our own –
how about if we switch presidents with Slovenia?
Two words: Social Courage.
Thanks for posting that, Jean!
Speaking of using fictional books and movies to make a point, Marco: have you seen "Crash" yet? It’s true - you cannot expect a refugee population from a war-ravaged country to assimilate like it’s nothing to them. At least not without the social services in place to help them. A few niceties will never make up for years of anguish as well as physical and mental scarring. But to exchange one environment of persecution and blind hatred for another is a recipe for disaster for everyone involved. The riots in France are a perfect example: second-generation Muslims are still being marginalized and treated as second-class citizens. The U.S. is far from perfect in this respect - sometimes VERY far - but I think many Americans recognize that almost all of us came from immigrant families (having first decimated the native population, it’s true..) As such, we all deserve a chance to be accepted on our own merits - not solely based on our religious beliefs, ethnicity, appearance, political stance, etc., although all of these factors do contribute to one’s character and sense of self.I have a much greater fear of close-mindedness and willful ignorance than I do of the behavior exhibited by any group of frightened but grateful refugees.It’s a good thing this is a moot point (for now).PS: And it’s not like I walk around with rose-colored glasses on. I grew up in a racially diverse area, and walked through "the projects" (read: "the ghetto") every day to get to my University classes in Newark, New Jersey. I also spent three years working in Corrections. I get it.
Speaking of using fictional books and movies to make a point, Marco: have you seen "Crash" yet? some people’s heads are stuck so far up their asses that they start to believe all their shit.
The article with the photo of Drni with flute is now published on Mladina’s website.
Oh and this time Mladina deffinitely got it wrong:Ko je šel Drnovšek v Bolivijo, je simbolno podprl novega
predsednika Moralesa, prvega predsednika kakšne latinskoameriške
države, ki ni potomec konkvistadorjev, zavojevalcev, paÄ? pa je
pripadnik avtohtonega ljudstva.
Nice. I didn’t think they
publish pictures. Ok maybe not first, but still four out of 65 presidents - that is still a rotten deal if you ask me…
I wonder why they all write
that. Maybe they mean ‘first elected’?